Register    Login    Search    Rss Feeds

 Page 1 of 2 [ 22 posts ] Go to page 1, 2  Next



 
Author Message
 Post subject: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 12:52 pm 
Offline
Course Students


Posts: 145
I do not know how to deal with this SC: I like none of the options
Consider as is wrong, so C and D are out.
What happens with A, B and E?

With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Farenheit, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with 60 square miles of water though to be frozen from top to bottom

A) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with
B) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, its
C) Europa has long been considered as far too cold to support life and has
D) Europa, long considered as far too cold to support life, and its
E) Europa, long considered to be far too cold to support life, and to have


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 11:46 pm 
Offline
Students


Posts: 111
IMO : A

With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Farenheit, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with 60 square miles of water though to be frozen from top to bottom

Can be reconstructed as :
With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Farenheit and with 60 square miles of water though to be frozen from top to bottom, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life.

I think the reason why they kept, Jupiter's moon.... in between, because of modifier issue, Modifier must touch the Noun.

C,D,E are out because of incorrect IDIOM :
consider as, consider to are wrong.
consider X Y is correct idiom.

Out of A and B : A maintains parallelism.
Please provide OA.


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2009 5:49 pm 
Offline
Course Students


Posts: 145
OA is B.
What is wrong with the other answer choices?


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 5:02 am 
Offline
ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
cesar.rodriguez.blanco wrote:
OA is B.
What is wrong with the other answer choices?


brief explanations:

(a)
"and with ..." isn't parallel to anything.
AND sets up parallelism, so there must be something to which "with..." can be parallel (other prepositional phrase, or other adverbial modifier). there is no such thing.

(b)
correct.
this is a type of modifier with which you should be familiar. (i have no idea what it's called - sorry)
here's another example:
john, his arms flailing in the wind, called out desperately for help.

note that the presence of frozen water SUPPORTS the claim that europa is "far too cold to support life", so it should be a MODIFIER.
this is done here.
it's inappropriate to place these two things in parallel with AND.

(c)
AND is rhetorically inappropriate (see above).
"considered as" is unidiomatic here.

(d)
this is not a sentence. (the clause before "and" doesn't have a verb; "considered" is a participle, not a verb, here)
"considered as" is unidiomatic here.

(e)
i don't think "considered to be" is wrong, although it's wordier than just "considered..."
this sentence has no verb at all! the only verb forms present are participles and infinitives, none of which is eligible to be the main verb of the sentence.


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Thu Feb 04, 2010 2:07 am 
Offline
Course Students


Posts: 24
In Choice A,

How come "With 60 square miles of..." isn't parallel to "To support life"

Aren't they prepositional phrase????


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Sat Feb 27, 2010 6:45 am 
Offline
ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
purduesr wrote:
In Choice A,

How come "With 60 square miles of..." isn't parallel to "To support life"

Aren't they prepositional phrase????


first of all, no, "to support life" is not a prepositional phrase. it's an infinitive. these are totally different constructions.

it's possible for "to" to be a preposition - e.g., i went to the grocery store - but that's not what this "to" is doing.
to help you tell the difference, note that ALL prepositions must be followed by NOUNS. since "support life" is a verb, not a noun, you have proof that this "to" is not a preposition.

second, "with... is a MODIFIER, and "to support life" is PART OF THE MAIN CLAUSE. therefore, there are no grounds for parallelism here.


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 6:15 am 
Offline
Students


Posts: 17
Hi Ron..

How to identify such modifiers because while solving this question i ruled out the right answer choice considering it a run on sentence


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Tue Mar 30, 2010 7:51 am 
Offline
ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
manjeet.singh wrote:
Hi Ron..

How to identify such modifiers because while solving this question i ruled out the right answer choice considering it a run on sentence


the best way to recognize them -- indeed, the only way -- is to look at examples of correct usage of each construction, until the constructions are thoroughly burned into your head.

this particular sort of construction is known as an "absolute phrase".
google it if you want to see tons and tons and tons of examples.

here's one hit i got on google:
http://www.cc.ysu.edu/~tacopela/Writing/Absolutes1.htm

(by the way, this is the one and only reason to care what grammatical constructions are called -- so you can google them and look at examples. if you're naming grammatical constructions during the actual problems, you're almost certainly not going to finish the problems on time.)


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 7:47 am 
Offline
Students


Posts: 19
Ron don't you think an "And" is missing in B ?
life, AND its


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Wed May 05, 2010 8:45 am 
Offline
ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
shatabdo.kal wrote:
Ron don't you think an "And" is missing in B ?
life, AND its


no.

this is a type of modifier with which you should be familiar. (if you're the type who likes to name things, this is called an "absolute phrase".)
here's another example:
john, his arms flailing in the wind, called out desperately for help.

--

far more importantly, remember that this is an OFFICIAL problem.
DO NOT QUESTION THE CORRECT ANSWERS TO OFFICIAL PROBLEMS.
it will always be a waste of your time to do this -- the official answers are never incorrect.

in summary:
* the WRONG question to ask is, "isn't that wrong?"
(the answer to this question will, 100% of the time, be "no, it's not wrong.")
* the RIGHT question to ask is, "what sort of construction is this, how is it used, and what can i do to recognize it in the future?"


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Wed Dec 15, 2010 3:39 pm 
Offline
Students


Posts: 15
[quote="RonPurewal"[/quote]

here's another example:
john, his arms flailing in the wind, called out desperately for help.
[/quote]

Hi Ron,

One question.
In the above example given by you, 'John' is the noun and 'his arm flailing in the wind' is the noun modifier, which is touching the noun.
But the noun modifier 'its 60 square miles of ......' does not touch the noun 'Jupiter's moon Europa' that is supposed to be modified.

Thanks.
Punzo


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Fri Dec 17, 2010 2:37 pm 
Offline
ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
punzo wrote:
RonPurewal wrote:

here's another example:
john, his arms flailing in the wind, called out desperately for help.


Hi Ron,

One question.
In the above example given by you, 'John' is the noun and 'his arm flailing in the wind' is the noun modifier, which is touching the noun.
But the noun modifier 'its 60 square miles of ......' does not touch the noun 'Jupiter's moon Europa' that is supposed to be modified.

Thanks.
Punzo


this is correct.

in fact, this sort of modifier ("absolute phrase") usually DOESN'T touch the noun that is actually describing.

check out this problem:
shark-s-tooth-t6220.html
in that correct answer, "each one ready..." modifies "spare teeth", which is the SUBJECT of the preceding clause.


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Sun May 22, 2011 10:55 pm 
Offline
Course Students


Posts: 2
Does the "and" in choices a, d and e necessarily create/mandate two independent clauses? Can you say that these choices are wrong because they create fragments?


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 9:17 am 
Offline
ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 1857
jenn.kimbal wrote:
Does the "and" in choices a, d and e necessarily create/mandate two independent clauses? Can you say that these choices are wrong because they create fragments?


Hi Jenn,
Check out Ron's explanation of A:
(a)
"and with ..." isn't parallel to anything.
AND sets up parallelism, so there must be something to which "with..." can be parallel (other prepositional phrase, or other adverbial modifier). there is no such thing.

The "and" does not mandate independent clauses; as Ron points out, a prepositional phrase or adverbial modifier would create the necessary parallelism.

_________________
Jamie Nelson
ManhattanGMAT Instructor


Top 
 Post subject: Re: SC: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees
 Post Posted: Tue Oct 11, 2011 2:56 pm 
Offline
Students


Posts: 11
At first, I thought that the choice A had the parallelism:
"...moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life,
and
with 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom."

or even more concise:
"... Europa has been considered and ... thought ..."

But then I figured out that in that case we wouldn't need comma after "to support life", so I ruled out A mostly on that basis. Was I at least partially correct?

After reading Ron's post, I see now that A does not have proper parallelism.
Do I understand it correctly , that we need to have an EXACT parallel structure to "and with 60 square miles of water thought".

For example, would be such sentence correct (as awkward as it is)?
"Jupiter's moon Europa has long been with surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit considered far too cold to support life and with 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom."

thanks in advance


Top 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 
 Page 1 of 2 [ 22 posts ] Go to page 1, 2  Next





Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

 
 

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: