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 Post subject: Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth,
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 10:02 pm 
Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth, to gather information about its size and curvature of its surface, new observations have been made by astronomers that show with startling directness the large-scale geometry of the universe.

(A) Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth, to gather information about its size and curvature of its surface, new observations have been made by astronomers
(B) Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth for gathering information about its size and also the curvature of its surface, new observations have been made by astronomers
(C) Similar to the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth, where they gathered information about its size and the curvature of its surface, astronomers have made new observations
(D) Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth gathering information about its size and the curvature of its surface, astronomers have made new observations
(E) Just as with the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth, gathering information about its size and curvature of the surface, astronomers have made new observations

The OA is D.
I wonder why "gathering information about its size and the curvature of its surface" can modify "the great navigators". I thought that if a present participle is not preceded by a noun, it modifies the noun preceding it.


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 Post subject: Re: Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Ea
 Post Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 10:21 pm 
H wrote:
Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth, to gather information about its size and curvature of its surface, new observations have been made by astronomers that show with startling directness the large-scale geometry of the universe.

(A) Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth, to gather information about its size and curvature of its surface, new observations have been made by astronomers
(B) Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth for gathering information about its size and also the curvature of its surface, new observations have been made by astronomers
(C) Similar to the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth, where they gathered information about its size and the curvature of its surface, astronomers have made new observations
(D) Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth gathering information about its size and the curvature of its surface, astronomers have made new observations
(E) Just as with the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth, gathering information about its size and curvature of the surface, astronomers have made new observations

The OA is D.
I wonder why "gathering information about its size and the curvature of its surface" can modify "the great navigators". I thought that if a present participle is not preceded by a noun, it modifies the noun preceding it.


I thought it was E.

Can someone explain why the answer is D and not E? I thought that you cannot use Like to compare two nouns preceded by verbs (Like "navigators sailed" ....compared with "astonomers made") but should use "as" in this case.


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 2:49 pm 
Sorry, typo.
I was trying to say:
I wonder why "gathering information about its size and the curvature of its surface" can modify "the great navigators". I thought that if a present participle is not preceded by a comma, it modifies the noun preceding it.


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 2:54 pm 
The "like" structure in D is absolutely fine:
Like the great navigators [restrictive clause], astronomers+V+O.
Like X, Y...
X=the great navigators
Y=astronomers

I believe that "just as X does something, Y does something" is the correct structure.


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Sat Jun 28, 2008 3:17 pm 
The present participle is a very weird verbal because it can be placed almost anywhere in the sentence, not only next to the noun or verb that it modifies. For this particular sentence, the sentence would not make sense if the participial "gathering information about its size and the curvature of its surface" referred to the Earth. In other words, the sentence would have been awkward if the participle modifier read that the earth gathered information about its size and its curvature. Therefore, the participle modifier can only refer to the subject in the sentence, the great navigators.


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:33 pm 
Here the comparison is made between Navigators and Astronomers ( Note the comparison is made between 2 nouns and not on their respective actions)

Hence It is preferred to use Like X <>, <Y>

Just by this rule, we can eliminate A,B,C and E

Moreover

Just as X, So Y is the correct Idiom E is out
B and A use wrong comparisons between navigators and observations

Choice C use of relative pronoun 'where' to refer to Earth makes no sense


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 Post subject: Great Explanations!
 Post Posted: Tue Jul 01, 2008 12:05 am 
H, Guest & Cobra - Great explanations, makes sense now!

I erroneously thought the comparison was with the 2 nouns and their respective actions, definetly not the case.

If the sentence was attempting to compare the nouns and actions, would the use of "as" in the sentence below make it correct? (Modified E)

(E) Just as the great navigators sailed around the Earth gathering information about its size and curvature of the surface, astronomers have made new observations

Also I noticed that the original E has "just as with" - is the addition of with ever right in a comparison? that seems like a point that could also be used to eliminate.


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 Post subject: Re: Great Explanations!
 Post Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:24 pm 
Offline
ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
GMAT Fever wrote:
Also I noticed that the original E has "just as with" - is the addition of with ever right in a comparison? that seems like a point that could also be used to eliminate.


comparisons are a special case of parallelism. therefore, if a sentence contains a parallel structure including the preposition 'with' as an integral part, then it can be properly used.

example:
i ate sushi more often with my last girlfriend than with the girlfriend before her.


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 8:05 pm 
Hi, although my post was answered a month ago by a guest, I am still not convinced that "gathering..." can grammatically skip through the preceding noun.

If D is rewritten with commas:

Like the great navigators, who first sailed around the Earth, gathering information about its size and the curvature of its surface, astronomers have made new observations that show with startling directness the large-scale geometry of the universe.

I can understand that "gathering information..." modifies the great navigators.

However, without the two commas, I don't understand that why "gathering..." can grammatically skip through the preceding noun.

For example,
Like GMAT that is as hard as LSAT focusing on critical reasoning mainly, GRE requires a lot time to prepare.

Should a reader interpret the first phrase as "GMAT focuses on critical reasoning mainly"?

Thanks in advance.


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Fri Oct 03, 2008 4:41 am 
Offline
ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
H wrote:
Hi, although my post was answered a month ago by a guest, I am still not convinced that "gathering..." can grammatically skip through the preceding noun.


if this is an authentic gmatprep problem (which it should be, given its having been posted in this folder), then the answer to this quandary is simple:
it's the official answer, so, "gathering" CAN, as you put it, "skip through the preceding noun." or, more likely, it's used as an adverbial modifier, modifying the preceding CLAUSE.

while you should of course be attuned to the vagaries of official gmat grammar, there's really no point in questioning practices that are deemed acceptable in official answers. if the gmat thinks that something is grammatically ok, then it's grammatically ok. it's their playground, they make the rules, and you're honestly wasting your study time by questioning those rules. (the gmat isn't a democracy.)

you can't write "the gmat that is as hard as...", because that implies that there are other gmat's that aren't as hard as the lsat.
analogy:
my brother, who lives in long beach, likes sushi --> i only have one brother, so the modifier is disposable and can be bracketed with commas
my brother who lives in long beach likes sushi --> i have more than one brother, so i have to single out the one who lives in The Beach
notice that this distinction is more subtle with people, because both essential and nonessential modifiers begin with 'who'. it's easier with objects, because you start essential modifiers with 'that' and nonessential modifiers with 'which'.


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 Post subject: Re: Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth,
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:18 am 
Offline
Prospective Students


Posts: 132
OK! the official answers are always right.
Ron! but there is still a question worthy thinking :
wether this gathering is used as adv to modify sailed around the Earth or as adj to modify navigators?

according to the original sentence--to gather information about its size... , gather seems like to function as adv to modify sailed around the Earth!
ron or stracey, i really want to read your oppinion!!


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 Post subject: Re: Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth,
 Post Posted: Sat Nov 21, 2009 10:20 am 
Offline
Prospective Students


Posts: 132
waiting..


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 Post subject: Re: Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth,
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 19, 2009 7:55 am 
Offline
ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
tankobe wrote:
OK! the official answers are always right.
Ron! but there is still a question worthy thinking :
wether this gathering is used as adv to modify sailed around the Earth or as adj to modify navigators?

according to the original sentence--to gather information about its size... , gather seems like to function as adv to modify sailed around the Earth!
ron or stracey, i really want to read your oppinion!!


i think it is adverbial, yes.


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 Post subject: Re: Like the great navigators who first sailed around the Earth,
 Post Posted: Sat Dec 19, 2009 7:57 am 
Offline
ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
tankobe wrote:
waiting..


hmm?

you posted "waiting...", two minutes after your original post?
i'm not sure how to respond to that.

--

also, you should know that we always answer the oldest posts first, so, if you try to "bump" threads like this, you'll actually be moving them all the way to the BACK of the line.


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