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joehurundas
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Post subject: is xy > 0 ? Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2010 8:03 am |
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Is xy > 0 ? (1) x - y > -2 (2) x - 2y < -6
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purnendu.shukla
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Post subject: Re: is xy > 0 ? Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2010 11:34 pm |
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I think answer is "C" combining A&B y>4 which -> x>2 so xy>0 suff
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vivekcall81
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Post subject: Re: is xy > 0 ? Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2010 2:28 am |
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C cannot be the answer if you x=3 and y=5 yes XY>0 but out it in to the equation x-y=3-5=-2 which is equal but not .-2 hence not satisfied and E should be the answer.
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adiagr
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Post subject: Re: is xy > 0 ? Posted: Fri Jun 18, 2010 3:24 am |
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vivekcall81 wrote: C cannot be the answer if you x=3 and y=5 yes XY>0 but out it in to the equation x-y=3-5=-2 which is equal but not .-2 hence not satisfied and E should be the answer. Vivek, Given (1) and (2), we have to see whether xy>0. Now x=3, y=5 x-y=-2, which means that (1) itself is not satisfied. so you cannot take this pair at all. From (1) and (2) together y>4 and x>2........so xy>0. It appears Ans is C.
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RonPurewal
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Post subject: Re: is xy > 0 ? Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 4:54 am |
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Quote: Vivek,
Given (1) and (2), we have to see whether xy>0.
Now x=3, y=5
x-y=-2, which means that (1) itself is not satisfied. so you cannot take this pair at all.
yes. @ vivek, at this point i would recommend a careful study of the first principles of data sufficiency -- it appears that you are still a bit hazy on how the data sufficiency problems work. without that sort of baseline understanding, you shouldn't advance to solving problems like this one yet. -- for any other readers reading this thread, the key to solving the statements together is the usual key to combining inequalities: IF THE INEQUALITIES ARE BOTH ">" OR BOTH "<", YOU CAN ADD THEM TOGETHER.the original versions of statements 1 and 2 have opposite inequality signs, so multiply the second one by -1 in order to achieve ">" on both: (1) x - y > -2 (2) 2y - x > 6 then add these together, to give y > 4. the rest of the solution is as posted above by other users.
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joehurundas
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Post subject: Re: is xy > 0 ? Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:39 pm |
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thanks all for your contributions to solving the problem; the trick, as explained by RonPurewal, lies in reversing the sign before addition. OA is C
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mschwrtz
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Post subject: Re: is xy > 0 ? Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 12:58 am |
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glad Ron (et alia) could help
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jigar24
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Post subject: Re: is xy > 0 ? Posted: Tue Jul 13, 2010 9:12 am |
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Hi Ron, but could you be more clear on how to eliminate 'B' first?.. I am able to eliminate 'A' (and so also 'D') easily but getting stuck on eliminating 'B' (only statement 2 alone is sufficient). Thanks
My approach:
In order for xy>0 both x and y either have to positive or both negative.. So, I tired to come up with numbers 1) both with same signs 2) Both with different signs .. if both these type work in a statement then it implies given statement is NOT sufficient..
In the process, I could very easily prove statement 1 insufficient but getting stuck (and taking an eternity) on statement 2 ... cant come up with examples fast enough..
Please help
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RonPurewal
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Post subject: Re: is xy > 0 ? Posted: Sun Aug 01, 2010 3:41 am |
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jigar24 wrote: Hi Ron, but could you be more clear on how to eliminate 'B' first?.. I am able to eliminate 'A' (and so also 'D') easily but getting stuck on eliminating 'B' (only statement 2 alone is sufficient). Thanks
My approach:
In order for xy>0 both x and y either have to positive or both negative.. So, I tired to come up with  numbers 1) both with same signs  2) Both with different signs .. if both these type work in a statement then it implies given statement is NOT sufficient..Â
In the process, I could very easily prove statement 1 insufficient but  getting stuck (and taking an eternity) on statement 2 ... cant come up with examples fast enough..
Please help this task is a lot easier if you solve the inequality for one of the variables, i.e., x < -6 + 2y. Â now, if you plug in something like 10 for y, you get x < 14, for which all three signs (positive, negative, and zero) are possible. Â so, insufficient. alternatively, if you don't think of solving the original inequality for x, just find a solution in which both numbers are positive (say, 10 and 10), and then realize that you can just make one of the numbers 0. Â that's good enough, since 0 > 0 is false. TAKEAWAY: there are three signs, not just two; positive, negative, and zero. don't forget that zero is a sign!
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jigar24
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Post subject: Re: is xy > 0 ? Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 3:31 am |
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Ron, I understood the first part that you mentioned.. That will surely make life much easier.. One has to try to get +ve value on the right hand side of '<' sign and a -ve value on the right hand side of '>' sign, in order to include all three signs and prove the statement insufficient.. Right??
However, I am still a bit unclear about your second explanation:
"alternatively, if you don't think of solving the original inequality for x, just find a solution in which both numbers are positive (say, 10 and 10), and then realize that you can just make one of the numbers 0. that's good enough, since 0 > 0 is false."
Could you please explain this once more, with an example??
Last edited by jigar24 on Tue Aug 03, 2010 3:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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jigar24
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Post subject: Re: is xy > 0 ? Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2010 3:36 am |
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RonPurewal
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Post subject: Re: is xy > 0 ? Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2010 9:32 am |
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jigar24 wrote: Ron, I understood the first part that you mentioned.. That will surely make life much easier.. One has to try to get +ve value on the right hand side of '<' sign and a -ve value on the right hand side of '>' sign, in order to include all three signs and prove the statement insufficient.. Right??
However, I am still a bit unclear about your second explanation:
"alternatively, if you don't think of solving the original inequality for x, just find a solution in which both numbers are positive (say, 10 and 10), and then realize that you can just make one of the numbers 0. that's good enough, since 0 > 0 is false."
Could you please explain this once more, with an example?? there's already an example in there. if x = 10 and y = 10, then statement 2 is satisfied, and the answer to the prompt question is "YES; xy > 0". now we need a NO (this is how number-plugging on data sufficiency works; you want to try to prove "insufficient", since further YES's won't help you). one easy way to get a NO will be to set one of x or y to 0, since 0 is not greater than 0. so, say, x = 0, and y = 10. then statement 2 is true again, but, NO, xy is not > 0 this time. therefore, insufficient. -- GRAPHICAL SOLUTION if you know what the graphs of these inequalities look like -- they're shaded on one side of a straight line -- then you'll know that any such inequality will have to shade in at least two neighboring quadrants. however, in any 2 neighboring quadrants, xy will have opposite signs; so we actually know that this statement is insufficient for ANY inequality of the form Ax + By < C or Ax + By > C. cool stuff.
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