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 Post subject: GMATPREP- Boomerangs
 Post Posted: Sat Jan 26, 2008 10:43 am 
Regardless of their form or function, all aerodynamically enhanced, curved objects made for throwing have been called boomerangs by non-Australians ever since 1788, when Europeans saw Dharug-speaking men tossing "bumariny" in the area later known as Sydney.

a) Regardless of their form or function, all aerodynamically enhanced, curved objects made for throwing have been called boomerangs by non-Australians ever since 1788,

b) Regardless of their form or function, any aerodynamically enhanced, curved object made for throwing has been called a boomerang by non-Australians ever since 1788,

c) Ever since 1788, non-Australians have called all aerodynamically enhanced, curved objects made for throwing boomerangs, regardless of their form or function, from

d) Ever since 1788, any aerodynamically enhanced, curved object made for throwing has been called a boomerang by non-Australians, regardless of its form or function, from

e) Non-Australians have called all aerodynamically enhanced, curved objects made for throwing boomerangs ever since 1788, regardless of their form or function, from




In this problem, I chose C, however the OA is A. What's wrong with option C and why is A correct? I chose C because I was trying to avoid "by" since it is used for passive sentences. When is "by" appropriate? Also, I chose C because I've noticed that sentences that generally start off with dates in the introductory phrase is preferred; However, it is wrong in this problem. :s So now, i'm officially confused! heheh...

[edited by Stacey to correct a typo in the problem]


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 9:37 pm 
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ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 6074
Location: San Francisco
You have to match the non-underlined portion of the sentence (which must be correct because it isn't underlined!). It starts with "when" and the word when refers to a time or date (in this case, a date. That date needs to be placed right before the "when." C, D, and E do not put that date right before the "when" (that is, at the end of the answer choice).

Couple of things:
- a phrase such as "ever since 1788" can correctly go at the beginning, at the end, in the middle... there's no grammar rule that says it is preferred at the beginning of a sentence.
- passive is not wrong; a completely grammatically correct active sentence is preferred to a completely grammatically correct passive sentence. Don't pick based on active / passive unless you have already determined that your remaining choices are (a) completely grammatically correct and (b) maintain the same meaning as the original sentence. AFTER that, you can use active vs. passive as a tiebreak.

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Stacey Koprince
Instructor
Director of Online Community
ManhattanGMAT


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 9:53 pm 
If option (b) above started with - Regardless of its form or function, ....rest all same.

Then would B be correct?


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 Post subject:
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2008 5:50 am 
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ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
diwrosh@gmail.com wrote:
If option (b) above started with - Regardless of its form or function, ....rest all same.

Then would B be correct?


i would say so.


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 Post subject: Re: GMATPREP- Boomerangs
 Post Posted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 3:15 pm 
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Posts: 21
a) Regardless of their form or function, all aerodynamically enhanced, curved objects made for throwing have been called boomerangs by non-Australians ever since 1788,

b) Regardless of their form or function, any aerodynamically enhanced, curved object made for throwing has been called a boomerang by non-Australians ever since 1788,


Is it because ... OBJECT is stated in the latter part of the sentence that we are assuning that the sentence will be right.. when ITS is placed int the former part of the sentence

Or

Is it because ANY must follow ITS., if so then what happened to SANAM pronouns ;-)


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 Post subject: Re: GMATPREP- Boomerangs
 Post Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 1:57 am 
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Course Students


Posts: 24
Quote:
Is it because ... OBJECT is stated in the latter part of the sentence that we are assuning that the sentence will be right.. when ITS is placed int the former part of the sentence

Or

Is it because ANY must follow ITS., if so then what happened to SANAM pronouns ;-)


It is because
Quote:
their
cannot refer to "aerodynamically enhanced, curved object"



b) Regardless of their form or function, any aerodynamically enhanced, curved object made for throwing has been called a boomerang by non-Australians ever since 1788,


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 Post subject: Re: GMATPREP- Boomerangs
 Post Posted: Thu Aug 27, 2009 4:48 am 
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ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
supshalu wrote:
a) Regardless of their form or function, all aerodynamically enhanced, curved objects made for throwing have been called boomerangs by non-Australians ever since 1788,

b) Regardless of their form or function, any aerodynamically enhanced, curved object made for throwing has been called a boomerang by non-Australians ever since 1788,


Is it because ... OBJECT is stated in the latter part of the sentence that we are assuning that the sentence will be right.. when ITS is placed int the former part of the sentence

Or

Is it because ANY must follow ITS., if so then what happened to SANAM pronouns ;-)


i'm not sure exactly what you're asking, but...

in (b), "their" is plural. the only plural to which it can refer is "non-Australians", which is clearly the wrong referent.

if you have "its" in an opening phrase (such as "regardless of its..."), then it automatically applies to the subject of the following clause, provided that this subject is singular.


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 Post subject: Re: GMATPREP- Boomerangs
 Post Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 5:27 am 
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Prospective Students


Posts: 132
Hi,Ron:
do we need all aerodynamically enhanced, curved objects to be the subject of the clause just because Regardless of their form or function precedes the clause with a comma?


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 Post subject: Re:
 Post Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2010 12:13 am 
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Forum Guests


Posts: 11
StaceyKoprince wrote:
You have to match the non-underlined portion of the sentence (which must be correct because it isn't underlined!). It starts with "when" and the word when refers to a time or date (in this case, a date. That date needs to be placed right before the "when." C, D, and E do not put that date right before the "when" (that is, at the end of the answer choice).

Couple of things:
- a phrase such as "ever since 1788" can correctly go at the beginning, at the end, in the middle... there's no grammar rule that says it is preferred at the beginning of a sentence.
- passive is not wrong; a completely grammatically correct active sentence is preferred to a completely grammatically correct passive sentence. Don't pick based on active / passive unless you have already determined that your remaining choices are (a) completely grammatically correct and (b) maintain the same meaning as the original sentence. AFTER that, you can use active vs. passive as a tiebreak.

Hi Stacey,
I don't understand why when must follow a time or data. I guess when could be a conjunctions and followed by a adverbial clause of time.


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 Post subject: Re: GMATPREP- Boomerangs
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 6:57 am 
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ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
tankobe wrote:
Hi,Ron:
do we need all aerodynamically enhanced, curved objects to be the subject of the clause just because Regardless of their form or function precedes the clause with a comma?


yes.


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 Post subject: Re: Re:
 Post Posted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 6:59 am 
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ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
jessie-cn2007 wrote:
I don't understand why when must follow a time or data. I guess when could be a conjunctions and followed by a adverbial clause of time.


stacy is not saying that "when" MUST follow a time or date.
rather, she is saying that, IF the "when" is referring to a time or date, it should follow that time or date immediately.


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 Post subject: Re:
 Post Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 1:01 am 
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Students


Posts: 100
diwrosh wrote:
If option (b) above started with - Regardless of its form or function, ....rest all same.

Then would B be correct?

Ron,
why is B still wrong if we change the "their" to "it"?

Actually,i think singular form is better than plural form to express this boomerang story.
as if plural form it may cause confusion---if one such thing appear, it should be called "a boomerang" or "a boomergs". you know, you are introducing a new name that people don't know its singular and plural forms.

so back to my query, I think if the "their" in B is changed to "it", it should be a right, even a better choice.

(or...if "any" is modifying a countable noun, it always means plural, which means the "object" should definitely be "objects"?... i don't think so though.)

Please do shed light on this. Thank you very much!


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 Post subject: Re: GMATPREP- Boomerangs
 Post Posted: Fri Sep 24, 2010 7:26 pm 
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ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 506
Ron,
why is B still wrong if we change the "their" to "it"?


He wrote that it would be correct.

so back to my query, I think if the "their" in B is changed to "it", it should be a right, even a better choice.

When the question, What if I changed this...? helps you to understand a grammatical issue, then it's useful. But be wary of asking it reflexively. And don't ask, Wouldn't this then be better than the OA? No, it wouldn't. Ever. Every wrong answer contains an error. No right answer contains an error, by GMAC's lights anyway. If you remove the error from a wrong answer, it doesn't have any fewer than the zero errors the right answer has.


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 Post subject: Re: GMATPREP- Boomerangs
 Post Posted: Sun Aug 28, 2011 8:24 am 
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Students


Posts: 25
Hi,
What is the grammatical difference between the "from when" construction and the "when" construction in the options ?

I was stuck between A and D, eventually chose A as it sounded better to my ear. But please shed some light on the way choice D ends.


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 Post subject: Re: GMATPREP- Boomerangs
 Post Posted: Sat Sep 03, 2011 5:18 pm 
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ManhattanGMAT Staff


Posts: 7146
pushkalk wrote:
Hi,
What is the grammatical difference between the "from when" construction and the "when" construction in the options ?

I was stuck between A and D, eventually chose A as it sounded better to my ear. But please shed some light on the way choice D ends.


in that choice, the presence of both "from" and "since" constitutes redundancy.

the 1788 modifier is also placed in a location that makes it difficult to figure out that the event mentioned at the end of the sentence took place in 1788.


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