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| Diesel engines burn as much as 30% less fuel |
| Re: Diesel engines burn as much as 30% less fuel |
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Guest
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A) 'as well as emitting....' is an adverbial modifer correctly modifying the phrase 'Diesel engines burn as much as 30% less fuel ...' B) 'as well as emit ...' is an adjective modifier incorrectly modifying the nound 'gasoline engines of comparable size' |
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| Re: Diesel engines burn as much as 30% less fuel |
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Ron Purewal
MGMAT STAFF
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are you sure you've copied this problem correctly? if you have, then i think it's the ugliest gmatprep problem i've ever seen. first of all, i don't like 'as much as 30% less fuel', which is ambiguous: it could mean (1) it burns less fuel than gas engines by up to 30% (i.e., it burns that much fuel or more), or (2) it burns a maximum of 30% less fuel - i.e., that much fuel or less (in the same way as 'up to 8 gallons' clearly means 8 gallons or less). additionally, 'as well as emitting' seems like the kind of thing that the gmat would brand as 'awkward and wordy', because it can so easily be replaced by and emit. ick. -- in choice b, 'as well as emit' is just plain wrong. memorize this as idiomatic usage if you like, but you can't use 'as well as' with that type of verb form. |
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tarek99
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Hi ron,
you said that "in choice b, 'as well as emit' is just plain wrong. memorize this as idiomatic usage if you like, but you can't use 'as well as' with that type of verb form." Is this applicable to ANY verbs? i know that verbs do not include the participles, but any base form of the verbs shouldn't be used with "as well as"?thanks |
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Ron Purewal
MGMAT STAFF
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i believe so. it's unfortunate that gmatprep problems are not accompanied by published solutions, as such solutions would contain the definitive word on issues like these. nevertheless: - i have never seen such usage in a reputable formal source. - this source does not mention anything close to that type of usage, leading to a plausible assumption that it's unacceptable. - the way that phrase is inserted into this problem strongly suggests (esp. in light of my extensive experience examining answer choice patterns on official problems) that it is meant to be incorrect. |
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Ranjit
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Apologies for bumping up this thread !
Isn't the comparison in "Diesel engines burn as much as 30% less fuel than gasoline engines of comparable size ..." incorrect? Shouldn't the sentence have a 'do' - "Diesel engines burn as much as ... less fuel than gas engines do? How can a comparison exist between fuel and gasoline engines? Ron, Could you please help clarify whether my thoughts are correct. Thank you. |
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| Diesel engines |
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jenizaros
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Hi Ron,
According Oxford University Dictionary, "as well as" + participle is an idiom and correct usage. But I agree with you on the fact this question is counter-intuitive. Its format contradict all we saw till today in OG. http://www.oup.com/oald-bin/web_getald7index1a.pl idiom as well (as sb/sth) in addition to sb/sth; too: Are they coming as well? * They sell books as well as newspapers. * She is a talented musician as well as being a photographer. note at "also" Jenizaros |
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| Diesel engines |
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jenizaros
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Hello again,
To go further, as with many other GMATPREP questions, the original phrase is from an article on New York Times. http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9803EED7173CF934A15756C0A9679C8B63&sec=&spon=&pagewanted=all But the use in journal is quite different from that in GMATPREP : NYT Diesel engines burn as much as 30 percent less fuel than gasoline engines of comparable size, and they emit far less carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases, which have been implicated in global warming. JENIZAROS |
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| Diesel engines |
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jenizaros
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Last comment, I promise.
It's clear that it's not the idea answer. So, we have two possible explanation : 1) The usage, and hence the question is incorrect. (I think it's quite unlikely because until now I've never seen a question that may hurt GMAC's credibility as a trustworthy (and risk averse) institution. ) 2) The option A is primus inter pares, it's to say first among equals or best among available options. (I think this is more likely.) Options A & B are very close to each other, more than others, however there are two differences : A) of comparable size, as well as emitting far less carbon dioxide gas and far fewer of the other gasses that have B) of comparable size, as well as emit far less carbon dioxide gas and far fewer of the other gasses having Hence if we assume the explanation N#2 is correct, then we can deduct that the use of "having" in B is a more grave error (in A, they use the relative pronoun "that") than the use of "as well as + participle" in A. JENIZAROS |
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| Re: Diesel engines |
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Ron Purewal
MGMAT STAFF
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sounds like a reasonable interpretation... we'll take a look at this one and see whether we can come up with anything brilliant that you haven't already posted here. |
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Anon
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Whats wrong with C ???
further it matches the NYT article.... the only issue I saw was with "they" ... but there is logical ||ism. Ron, need your help... |
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Anon
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oops...missed the fewer...
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Rey Fernandez
MGMAT STAFF
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Caught it yourself... nice work.
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